Help! 40D or 50D?

[ketsuryo]

Please help! My friend is in such a confused state she doesn't know what to do anymore!
She currently has a 400d and is thinking to upgrade to either 40D or 50D.
From what she researched so far most people she spoke to seems to prefer 40D as it apparently has better noise handling.
(very quietly: I am not Canon user so I can't help her at all - please don't kick me out of here... I am only trying to help...)
Has anyone been lucky enough to handle both and be kind enough to let me know what you think please? (if you can include your reasoning so I can pass on to her you will be my hero!)

Question number 2.
She has decided to get the 50mm f/1.4, but she's also hoping to pick up a zoom lens as well. Any suggestions? She will be mainly photographing her 2 boys and assorted portraits, maybe some travel shoots...

Thank you very much for your feedback, much appreciated!

[aim54x]

I am no Canon user either, but I can say that the 50mm f/1.4 is a good choice, maybe a 17-40mm f/4L or a 24-70mm f/2.8L would be a nice addition to the 50mm f/1.4 but I do warn about their price tag! On a more sane note maybe look at at Tamron 28-70mm f/2.8 or the Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8.

I have however used the 40D on a few occasions and think it is a nice camera (but i still prefer my Nikon D300) my only gripes are a preferential thing. I have not had the pleasure of using a 50D yet, but a few forum members have them so maybe they can shed some light on this.

Cheers

[Doctor]

I Havnt compared the 40d to the 50d but have recently grabbed myself a 50d having upgraded from a 400d.

The 50d is a great camera, the screen on the back is a huge improvement over the 400d and the feel of the camera itself is infinitely better and i have no regrets at all. The scroll wheel etc is a massive improvement over the buttons on the 400d, as for which to buy, no idea.... i felt the 50d was the best for me, and bought it, best of luck

[moz]

As far as I can tell the noise per pixel is about the same. Of course, there are a lot more pixels so the noise at a given output resolution is lower. In other words if you resize the full image to 3000x2000 it will have less noise than the same shot from a 40D doing the same thing. Since few people will use the extra pixels to print larger prints that's the measurement that counts I think.

The 50D is a noticably better camera, even ignoring the video capability. The screen alone is worth paying the extra for in my opinion.

[makario]

I've got the 50D, having upgraded from the 350D and I love the improvement (or should I say leap), I have read the reviews on many website and I still love the camera. Would I have gone in for a 40D, seeing that its about 500-600 AUD cheaper, I would like to think I made the right decission with the 50D. what I love about it (1) the LCD screen its cool as (2) the ability to do micro adjustments for lens - will I use it.. maybe not yet, but its great to have the feature in the event I want to get the most out of the camera, (3) I love the IQ (4) newer technology being the Digic iV.

There was a lot of talk about the Err99 that you would get with the 50D, apparently its fixed the latest patch from canon.

In terms of the lenses the 50mm f1.4 is a great lens, but also remember, depending on your level of experience with shallow DOF you will need to stop it down to get sharper pictures. If you are just starting out, maybe a zoom lens would be a good place to start...

My 2cents
Cheers
Mak

[devilla101]

Hey ketsuryo,

I would advise your friend to go to the store themselves and have a fiddle with the camera and if they can, shoot a couple of images in raw+jpg. Body wise they are basically the same but its the features or lack of (depending on 40D or 50D) that may help your friend make a much more informed and wise purchase.

Me personally was looking to upgrade to a 40D from a 30D when they first came out, but after playing around with my brothers and looking at the new features I felt it just wasn't enough to let me upgrade. Enter the 50D which had features I wanted like hi res screen, manual adjustment of lenses, higher iso sensitivity, sRAW 1 and auto iso. Hence I upgraded and so far so good. Despite the negative reviews regarding IQ that seems to populating the web, I haven't regretted my purchase nor have I been disappointed with the quality of images it has produced (I've also got a 5D).

Regarding the 50mm 1.4 lens, that will become a sweet portrait lens because of the 1.6x. Regarding zoom tell her to go with the 17-55 2.8. A nice versatile lens that would fit the bill for her intended purpose. Both lenses are light (in the wallet and around the neck)

All in all your friend cannot go wrong with either cameras. It comes down to features and whether or not your friend like them

Anyway hope that helps

[MSF]

I have both a 40D and 50D at the moment (as well as my older 30D which is now the backup's backup until I find a buyer)

I have done about 4,000 frames through the 50D now and to be honest, I don't find much difference in the normal stuff I shoot.
So far - the only time that I was thinking "wow, I'm glad I updated" and the major benefit I have found with the 50D is the rear screen resolution and the better live view benefits it offers.
I did a product shoot for a friend the other week and the improved resolution and focusing made it so much easier to get the shot easier..

For me it was a no brainer to update from the 40D - I was able to get the 50D cheaper than the 40D was. (I paid $1,512 for the 50D and $1,591 for the 40D when it was first released).
I needed to retire the 30D and either get either, another 40D, or wait until the 50D was released..

The high ISO problem, - yes, I must admit that it is noticable - but I rarely shoot very high ISO, it was not a major concern for me.

In the next few days, I will be taking them both out to a couple of locations and try to get the exact same image through each camera at various settings - Not for any other reason than to see just how different they really are.. - that way, I either decide to get another 50D (and retire the 40D), or just be happy with what I have...

Ohh, BTW, I very rarely shoot RAW, but will do so for the comparisons.

[Doctor]

As far as I can tell the noise per pixel is about the same. Of course, there are a lot more pixels so the noise at a given output resolution is lower. In other words if you resize the full image to 3000x2000 it will have less noise than the same shot from a 40D doing the same thing. Since few people will use the extra pixels to print larger prints that's the measurement that counts I think.

The 50D is a noticably better camera, even ignoring the video capability. The screen alone is worth paying the extra for in my opinion.

Id agree with all of that..... Except the Video part, i think your thinking of the 5d MkII, that has 1080p Video.... and if the 50d does have it, i had no idea! Best be trying to work out how to make mine do it!

[ketsuryo]

Thank you all so very much! You guys (and if there's any girls please don't get offended - it's a bit hard to tell from nicknames) rock!
I'll pass the opinions on to my friend and see what she decides...

As far as I can tell the noise per pixel is about the same. Of course, there are a lot more pixels so the noise at a given output resolution is lower. In other words if you resize the full image to 3000x2000 it will have less noise than the same shot from a 40D doing the same thing.

I have to admit I have never thought of the noise level this way when doing comparisons... but it actually makes sense...

In the next few days, I will be taking them both out to a couple of locations and try to get the exact same image through each camera at various settings - Not for any other reason than to see just how different they really are.. - that way, I either decide to get another 50D (and retire the 40D), or just be happy with what I have...

Ohh, BTW, I very rarely shoot RAW, but will do so for the comparisons.

Oh, and MSF, we'll be very interested to hear from you about the result of your comparisons. Please please let us know what you think after the photo shoot. (and RAW is even better coz my friend loves using RAW)

[ozimax]

I have just ordered a 40D at $1071 (AUD) (which = approx $700 USD). This is a crazy price for an outstanding camera. That would be my pick. Add a 50mm F1.4 and a 70-200 F4 (non IS) and you have a very capable and affordable bundle. The only lacking part would be the wide end of things. If cash is a problem, maybe the Tamron 17-50 F2.8 could be considered. It is supposedly very good.

Hope this helps.

Ozi.

[aim54x]

Add a 50mm F1.4 and a 70-200 F4 (non IS) and you have a very capable and affordable bundle. The only lacking part would be the wide end of things. If cash is a problem, maybe the Tamron 17-50 F2.8 could be considered. It is supposedly very good.

Ozi.

Why not go the Tamron double 17-50mm f/2.8 and 70-200mm f/2.8 + the Canon EF 50mm f/1.4?

Canon 70-200mm f/4L or Tamron 70-200mm f/2.8 - hmmm that is interesting choice, I am not sure which I'd go with and if you want to add the Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 HSM it becomes even more interesting!

[ozimax]

Canon 70-200mm f/4L or Tamron 70-200mm f/2.8 - hmmm that is interesting choice, I am not sure which I'd go with and if you want to add the Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 HSM it becomes even more interesting!

The Canon 70-200 F4 is one incredible piece of glass. I sold mine to buy the 2.8 IS version and regretted it. Having said that, I do think that my copy of the IS version was a dud, but Canon has a wonderful array of lens in this focal length. I can't comment on the Sigma lens as I have never owned one.

Ozi.

[gstark]

I can't comment on the Sigma lens as I have never owned one.

You'll never go far in politics, will you?

[ozimax]

I can't comment on the Sigma lens as I have never owned one.

You'll never go far in politics, will you?

But let me say this. We are progressing for working families, yes, that's it, working families ..... don't you worry about that!

[Leginmat]

I've had a 350D since November '05 and decided that it was finally time to upgrade the body.

I contemplated the 50D and went in store to play with it and was impressed but after reading the numerous reviews on it, the 40D seemed more of a wise investment, especially since I also got a free bonus goodies and with my upcoming overseas trip, I can get GST back meaning I only pay $950 for a brand new body!

The differences physically of the two bodies is the same. The 50D of course boasts those extra goodies but I don't find myself using those goodies often so opted to save some dollars and spend it on some decent glass instead

Am loving it so far!

With Sigma zooms, I've had very good experience with the 100-300mm f/4 and have heard and seen good things from the 70-200.

Good luck in her decision!

[gstark]

and with my upcoming overseas trip, I can get GST back meaning I only pay $950 for a brand new body!

Are you sure?

Item 1: You only get to claim this back on your departure within 30 days of the purchase. That's the easy part.

Item 2: You have to declare this as a purchase upon your return to Australia, and it comes off your otherwise duty/GST free allowance upon re-entry. That's the catch!

Item 2 will not be a problem provided you do not do any shopping while overseas. If, however, you were thinking of milking your duty-free allowance on the way back in, think again: your first traveler's allowance has been fully expended. If you're traveling solo, that's it.

[ozimax]

If, however, you were thinking of milking your duty-free allowance on the way back in, think again: your first traveler's allowance has been fully expended. If you're traveling solo, that's it.

Marry a wife on the way out of Australia, then bring her back into the country. That doubles your allowance! Working families every time.

See, I think I could make a politician.

[ketsuryo]

Marry a wife on the way out of Australia, then bring her back into the country. That doubles your allowance! Working families every time.

... does that make her instantly an Australian without any waiting period? (assuming she's not an Aussie to start with)

... back to the topic, my friend seems to set her mind on 40D now, thank you all for your help. She couldn't get her hand on either of the lenses she wanted at the moment, which is a pity... hopefully she won't have to wait too long...

[Leginmat]

and with my upcoming overseas trip, I can get GST back meaning I only pay $950 for a brand new body!

Are you sure?

Item 1: You only get to claim this back on your departure within 30 days of the purchase. That's the easy part.

Item 2: You have to declare this as a purchase upon your return to Australia, and it comes off your otherwise duty/GST free allowance upon re-entry. That's the catch!

Item 2 will not be a problem provided you do not do any shopping while overseas. If, however, you were thinking of milking your duty-free allowance on the way back in, think again: your first traveler's allowance has been fully expended. If you're traveling solo, that's it.

Can you please explain further. Once again, I am yet to learn any of these regulations as I don't frequently travel.

Yes, I qualify for Item 1 and Item 2 would not be a problem with me unless I misunderstand?. I am heading to Europe for almost three months to stay with my mother. By that time, upon return, do I still have to declare it as goods? Does a three month old camera still qualify as new? and no, I don't plan to purchase any camera gear or goods in Paris after seeing their pricing

Another one, would I be able to take advantage of this refund scheme with more than one item from more than one retailer? I'm in need of some glass and plan to purchase for the trip.

No thanks on the marriage. I'd rather cop the fine

Cheers

[ozimax]

You can claim a refund on GST when the total of goods from a single retailer reaches $300, on the same receipt. I believe you could apply this to several different retailers if you so wished.

As for a 3 month trip, I'm not sure. I purchased a couple of lens last year, went to NZ for 4-5 weeks. By the time I re-entered Australia, the lens were well used and no longer new, and that was reflected in the amount I declared. I can't remember the details offhand. (Boy, I am sounding like a polly..that's a worry).

I'm not sure where the law stands on aging value of goods and their declared amount etc.

Cheers,

Ozi.

[gstark]

Yes, I qualify for Item 1 and Item 2 would not be a problem with me unless I misunderstand?. I am heading to Europe for almost three months to stay with my mother. By that time, upon return, do I still have to declare it as goods? Does a three month old camera still qualify as new?

Yes, for the purposes of re-entry.

And it's nothing to do with being new. It's basically goods not purchased within Australia, or good purchased within Australia but utilising the GST concession.

The customs officer, upon your re-entry, has latitude to depreciate the value of your goods if they have been used, but that's discretionary: do you feel lucky?

And the limit that you have doesn't just apply to photographic goods. You'll most likely be stopping in HKG or SIN on the way out, and again on the way back. That nice new iPod, or the pen that bought duty free on the way back, also needs to be accounted for. At the price you paid, converted to PP.

Another one, would I be able to take advantage of this refund scheme with more than one item from more than one retailer? I'm in need of some glass and plan to purchase for the trip.

Yes, that applies, provided the aggregate value of any purchase from any one retailer is PP300 or more.

So, you can buy a body from Ted's for PP900, a lens and flash unit from Michael's at PP450, (say 250 plus 200), and then claim the refund back for the GST on those two purchases - PP1350 in total.

But now you have PP1350 worth of stuff (already) for when you return.

No thanks on the marriage. I'd rather cop the fine

It's only called a "fine" if you fail to declare, or mislead. Otherwise it's called GST.

... does that make her instantly an Australian without any waiting period? (assuming she's not an Aussie to start with)

No. It merely makes her your wife, and with no guarantee of reentry privileges either.

[Leginmat]

Ah I see. So what if I was to not claim any GST on my departure. Would I still have to declare my camera upon arrival?

I am indeed stopping over in Singapore but only at the airport before continuing. I have absolutely no intentions to purchase any more goodies as I've spent over $3000 on camera equipment alone in the past week alone! That's more than what I spend on myself for food and necessities for years The only purchase I do plan on making is a laptop which is for my mother at Singapore but that will be left with her.

(Sorry to hijack the thread )

Cheers

[gstark]

Ah I see. So what if I was to not claim any GST on my departure. Would I still have to declare my camera upon arrival?

No. In that case, it leaves Oz with you, as tax-paid stuff. You can, on departure, have Customs certify that you're leaving with those goods, too. That saves any hassles on the way back in. That said, I have never had any issues with any of this sort of stuff, in several trips over the last ten or so years.

Typically, one can be reasonably expected to be carrying a laptop, and an SLR plus a few lenses within your personal effects, and nobody will bat an eye. The problem is that you need to be fully aware of what the law is, and then you can decide how best to handle your own situation, which will be different from mine, his, her's ....

I am indeed stopping over in Singapore but only at the airport before continuing.

And what makes you think you won't be doing any shopping there? There's lots and lots and lots of shops: electronics, photographics, perfumes, shoes, leather goods, handbags .... did I mention electronics and photographics?

If you're laid over for more than six hours, there's an airport hotel where you can a room in six hour blocks (grab a shower and nap), or you can leave the airport and grab a bus into the city and have a quick look around and a bite to eat. All this whilst in transit!

I have absolutely no intentions to purchase any more goodies

Ok, great. Now we know your intentions.

Reality is a very different thing.

The only purchase I do plan on making is a laptop which is for my mother at Singapore but that will be left with her.

Anything that you buy but not bring back in is irrelevant in terms of Oz Customs. That is perhaps where you might wish to look at the GST side of things too, though. I don't think that you'll save a whole lot on a laptop in SIN, and it will also be able to be used by you to garner a GST refund on the way out.

Depending upon your mum's needs, you should be able to pick up something for PP800 - PP1500, claim your GST back on that on your way out (and yes, if you're not buying anything else, then also claim your GST back on the cameras and such) and then deal witht the camera on the way back in.

As it happens, that is actually the way the GST claim back is supposed to work: for goods that are exported from the country.

[Leginmat]

Haha, well, I shall try my best to resist while I'm there! I considered the hotel but the last time I was there, my father and I managed a 12 hour layover by just browsing the lounges and snoozing wherever we can as we didn't book a hotel and conveniently, they were booked out that night.

Thanks a bunch for your advice and help Gary. At least now I have a better understanding of all this business!

Cheers

[Grev]

Apparently, I quite like the 450D compared to either the 40 or 50D...

450D + 24-70 is a good combo (plus a prime), cheap and good.

[aim54x]

Apparently, I quite like the 450D compared to either the 40 or 50D...

450D + 24-70 is a good combo (plus a prime), cheap and good.

Finally back on topic, but i would have to say that i would also consider the 1000D + 24-70 + 50 1.4 if we were to go on the insanely light kit!